TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

rahien.din
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby rahien.din » Sat Sep 03, 2016 11:22 am

Your wish is my command.

Now with more plays, making it a mostly-usable formation.
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

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Gregatron
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Gregatron » Wed Apr 26, 2017 12:38 pm

This is interesting. I prefer relatively symmetrical formations, so I can flip plays without the players needing to switch sides. I had been thinking of making a 3-safety 3-3-5 defense like I used in NCAA 2014, but I don't know all the intricacies of the differences between 3-3 and 4-2 fronts. I'm totally enjoying playing around with the 4-2-5 and I'm thinking about incorporating it into the Cover 2 playbook I'm working on.

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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Gregatron » Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:27 pm

The problem with designing it as a 4-3 and putting SS at ROLB is that he would be part of the LB shifts and not the DB shifts. Except for that, it should work pretty well. You could use the playbook editor to set it so play flips would pair ROLB with SS and MLB with LOLB. FS would be the centerpoint of the DBS and would always keep his assignment. You might need to realign the formations a bit, such as moving the ROLB away from the line, SS toward the line, and FS toward the center of the field. I'm writing this on theory, of course. I'm going to test it out right now.

Oh, and I tried a quick experiment with a 3-3-5. In 3WR sets, the MLB moved over to the slot receiver. Not the SS, not even the OLB. The MLB. In 4WR trips formations, the MLB and the OLB moved over to the slot receivers, right on top of the SS. Moving the SS farther out in the base formation did nothing to change this. Is there a way to fix it?

Double-U
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Double-U » Wed Apr 26, 2017 4:06 pm

Gregatron wrote:The problem with designing it as a 4-3 and putting SS at ROLB is that he would be part of the LB shifts and not the DB shifts. Except for that, it should work pretty well. You could use the playbook editor to set it so play flips would pair ROLB with SS and MLB with LOLB. FS would be the centerpoint of the DBS and would always keep his assignment. You might need to realign the formations a bit, such as moving the ROLB away from the line, SS toward the line, and FS toward the center of the field. I'm writing this on theory, of course. I'm going to test it out right now.

Oh, and I tried a quick experiment with a 3-3-5. In 3WR sets, the MLB moved over to the slot receiver. Not the SS, not even the OLB. The MLB. In 4WR trips formations, the MLB and the OLB moved over to the slot receivers, right on top of the SS. Moving the SS farther out in the base formation did nothing to change this. Is there a way to fix it?


It can be designed as 4-3 and put the SS at ROLB. Using Packfan's editor to edit the shifts will allow you to shift the SS with the DB's! Already done in my Flexbase book! There's also an option that when you flip the play, the players retain their positions! Realignment can also be done in the packfan editor!

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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Gregatron » Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:08 pm

moonbax wrote:This appears to be the only option available for all-5+ DB defenses, which there appear to be multiple examples of in the NCAA. And it appears as though the author put a lot of thought into the gap assignments and audibles. I'll check to see how/if this book functions any differently than a stock EA book with only 5+ DB sets would function. If anyone else could check it out and confirm or deny whether all of the features perform the same way as the 4-2-5 nickel in EA's playbooks that would be very helpful.


I ran tests with ALL the nickel sets in a cover 2 zone defense against a 3WR set with the slot receiver on the opposite side from CB3. In EVERY case, a linebacker slid over to the slot receiver, even when the SS was already right there. I also tried it with the Flexbase21 and 46 Fire custom playbooks and got the same result. When the slot receiver is on the same side as CB3, nobody slides. It's like there is a priority system in place for who lines up over the slot receiver: CB - LB - S. Perhaps the only way to get a working 3-safety formation where the SS can swap routes without switching sides would be to use a dime package, put SS in for CB3 and CB4, and put an MLB in for SS and move him up into the middle of the box. More spitballing.

Double-U
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Double-U » Fri Apr 28, 2017 7:17 pm

Gregatron wrote:
moonbax wrote:This appears to be the only option available for all-5+ DB defenses, which there appear to be multiple examples of in the NCAA. And it appears as though the author put a lot of thought into the gap assignments and audibles. I'll check to see how/if this book functions any differently than a stock EA book with only 5+ DB sets would function. If anyone else could check it out and confirm or deny whether all of the features perform the same way as the 4-2-5 nickel in EA's playbooks that would be very helpful.


I ran tests with ALL the nickel sets in a cover 2 zone defense against a 3WR set with the slot receiver on the opposite side from CB3. In EVERY case, a linebacker slid over to the slot receiver, even when the SS was already right there. I also tried it with the Flexbase21 and 46 Fire custom playbooks and got the same result. When the slot receiver is on the same side as CB3, nobody slides. It's like there is a priority system in place for who lines up over the slot receiver: CB - LB - S. Perhaps the only way to get a working 3-safety formation where the SS can swap routes without switching sides would be to use a dime package, put SS in for CB3 and CB4, and put an MLB in for SS and move him up into the middle of the box. More spitballing.


That's a issue with all custom playbooks that aren't created using the in-game editor. Man-Lock does not transpose to custom plays at all.If you get the ManLock solved let me know!

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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Gregatron » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:21 pm

I used the in-game editor to start mine but I used an empty playbook. Would it make a difference if I started with a stock playbook? I'm about to try it and see. Figuring out manlock would be great so my lbs aren't leaving the middle of the field wide open playing zone against trip wr sets.

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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Gregatron » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:37 pm

Well that didn't change anything. I also tried a dime package where I moved the ss down by the lb. Then made a package putting ss in for cb3 and cb4 and lb in for ss. It solved the problem of the lb moving out over the slot receiver, but the ss came in from slot position to over center when there was no slot receiver. Switching the play did nothing to fix this. I guess you just have to pick the lesser of two evils to have a 5db base. SS moving inside when there is no slot receiver or lb moving outside when there is one.

Double-U
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Re: TCU 4-2-5 Defense Playbook

Postby Double-U » Sat Apr 29, 2017 1:12 pm

Gregatron wrote:Well that didn't change anything. I also tried a dime package where I moved the ss down by the lb. Then made a package putting ss in for cb3 and cb4 and lb in for ss. It solved the problem of the lb moving out over the slot receiver, but the ss came in from slot position to over center when there was no slot receiver. Switching the play did nothing to fix this. I guess you just have to pick the lesser of two evils to have a 5db base. SS moving inside when there is no slot receiver or lb moving outside when there is one.


I could have swore, I already stated that you needed to have at least one stock play in the book to incorporate the "Madden Logic"!! Creating a book that's blank does not carry the code! Custom playbooks do not have the trigger for the menu driven "pre-snap Man-lock", even though the custom Nickel defense logic assigns man coverage to CB3 to check WR3, no matter where he lines up on the field! And if the WR3 goes in motion, CB3 is supposed to follow not "pass-off"!! In-game pre-snap shifts and line up on man work just fine... So your best bet is to load up the stock defenses into a custom book, save it, then edit in external editor! My T-Rex defensive book has the logic because I modified stock formations and plays! Flexbase is totally custom built inside madden, but edited using packfans editor! In-game editor does not allow many things like, basic play action, motions, fake handoffs, specialty plays like flea-flicker. Editing defense is even worse, extreme vanilla!


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