Players Roles&Weapons Assignment

[Eros]

Hello guys. Its been quite some time I haven’t played Madden so i thought it’s time to come back and I did it by continuing a project that I have been working for long period of time. Assigning player roles/weapons with the new Rogerjinx overall calculator system.

Now why to lose time with player roles/weapons? I think for those who play the franchise mode like me, these roles/weapons really enhance the gameplay of the franchise. Like for example players being more valuable in trades thanks to certain roles.

Now in the file attached I have created a sort of database, maybe the word database it’s a little bit too much , that describes what attributes or characteristics a player need to have for certain Role/Weapon. Despite I have been working on it for a long period of time it still needs a lot of tweaking.

Guys I would love to know your opinions or advises or any ideas.

[jose21crisis]

This definitely looks interesting. I've been trying to make a similar database, both with the Madden ratings, as well as real life stats (Which I'm finding hard. How do you determine that a QB is a Cannon Arm QB with real life stats? How many successful deep passes he performed? How you determine Power/Elusive Backs?). Here's my tips about this:

• The Power Back Role: I've found that Strength has nothing to do with how effective a player is when trucking. Only Break Tackle alters whenever the player can run over a defender or not.
• About Break Tackles: Something I've found is that the game will consider a HB to be a "Power" HB (The Player Tendency) when the back's Breck Tackle is 82+, but Speed less than 88. I'd recommend that for both the Power Back and Feature Back, the Break Tackle rating requiered is 82.
• Defensive Linemen/Edge Rusher Roles: For Pass Rushers, I would recommend adding 70+ Speed in there. Run Stopper is fine as it is.

Good job on this compilation.

[Eros]

This definitely looks interesting. I've been trying to make a similar database, both with the Madden ratings, as well as real life stats (Which I'm finding hard. How do you determine that a QB is a Cannon Arm QB with real life stats? How many successful deep passes he performed? How you determine Power/Elusive Backs?). Here's my tips about this:

• The Power Back Role: I've found that Strength has nothing to do with how effective a player is when trucking. Only Break Tackle alters whenever the player can run over a defender or not.
• About Break Tackles: Something I've found is that the game will consider a HB to be a "Power" HB (The Player Tendency) when the back's Breck Tackle is 82+, but Speed less than 88. I'd recommend that for both the Power Back and Feature Back, the Break Tackle rating requiered is 82.
• Defensive Linemen/Edge Rusher Roles: For Pass Rushers, I would recommend adding 70+ Speed in there. Run Stopper is fine as it is.

Good job on this compilation.

First of all thanks.

About the cannon arm I determine it based only on madden attributes. I have tried to do it with real life stats but they are very misleading and nearly impossible to find an exact stat. Does a successful rate of deep passes completion means you have a Cannon for an arm? Personally i don’t think so. A lot of times the best deep ball throwers don’t have the biggest arm. Give a look to this article https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat- ... ll-project. See the second table table. Joe Flacco who is considered to have a Cannon of an arm is really an inaccurate deep ball passer while Alex Smith who has one of the “weakest arm” in the league is really an accurate deep ball passer.

Maybe a stat that can determine a Cannon arm is Deep Ball percentage in tight windows, the third table . Even that don’t i know. Anyway I think you should give a look at this site . It has a lot of deep ball different type of stats. Maybe it may help you to find one that you like.

Mmmm about the Power Back Role. I really loved you tip. I will make some changes now a player to be considered a power back needs to have 82+ Break Tackle and speed less than 88. Even though some players like J. Howard or M. Lynch will be not be considered as “Power HB” with this new rating. Since the strength rating doesn’t determine the effectiveness of a player trucking I will eliminate it. Also the break tackle rating will be 82+ for Feature Backs.

About the Edge rushers. I wanted to add the 70+ speed but as I was searching through the players attributes i saw that edge rusher who have a 85+ acceleration nearly 95% have a 70+ speed and 80-85% 80+ speed. So I don’t think speed it’s a stat that defines or changes anything in the pass rushing weapon.

[jose21crisis]

I don't think the "Less than 88 Speed" is necessary for the Power HB weapon. A guy can be fast but be able to run a man over (Adrian Peterson in his prime, Marshawn Lynch).

[rogerjinx]

Good stuff. Now I dont have to simulate just to let the AI assign the roles. I can make an excel template to validate all players if they qualify/lose a particular role. I actually update the attribute ratings often during the season everytime EA release their ratings update.

Could we finalize this? If I may add, we can also make use of attributes non-existent in Madden08 (Catch in Traffic, Press etc) so they can be of use to power up the roles for Elder Madden.

[jose21crisis]

Good stuff. Now I dont have to simulate just to let the AI assign the roles. I can make an excel template to validate all players if they qualify/lose a particular role. I actually update the attribute ratings often during the season everytime EA release their ratings update.

Could we finalize this? If I may add, we can also make use of attributes non-existent in Madden08 (Catch in Traffic, Press etc) so they can be of use to power up the roles for Elder Madden.

Pretty sure that's possible. Madden 08/09 in the Xbox 360 also had player weapons that used the newer ratings. Here's a list of those player weapons, as well as their triggers in that game and what each Weapon does (Except for Speed Weapons, which are pretty obvious) and each weapon counter according to EA:

• Smart QB (Let's the QB bring up the Defensive Play Cam. The defensive Smart Weapons. Calling different plays also prevents this weapon from being too useful.): 92+ Awareness.
• Cannon Arm QB (QB can throw it farther away, and can give some additional zip to the ball. Shut Down Corners can prevent receivers from getting open, Press Corners can prevent the development of routes, Smart Safeties can read the play and an Aggressive Defense can prevent the QB from having enough time to allow receivers to get open,): 95+ Throwing Power.
• Accurate QB (Precision Passer in Madden 08 Gen6. Pass Leading is more precise, deep passing is more accurate and QB is less likely to overthrow or underthrow his target. Accuracy on the run is not guaranteed however.): 94+ Throwing Accuracy.
• Speed QB (Scrambler in Gen6.): 80+ Speed.
  
• Elusive Back (RB can better execute Spins and Jukes. Usually they are small players, which makes them vulnerable to Big Hitters.): 92+ Elusiveness
• Power Back (RB can run over defenders and fall forward when tackled far more constantly. Big Hitters and Brick Wall Defenders can wrap up these RBs): 90+ Trucking
  
• Stiff Arm Ball Carrier (Stiff Arms are extremely effective. RBs, WRs and TEs can get this one. Stripping the ball out of them proves to be effective.): 95+ Stiff Arm.
  
• Quick Receiver (Cuts during the route are faster and gets more separation from DBs, as well as being able to get great release against Press Coverage. Shutdown corners can effectively match these receivers 1-on-1.): 91+ Route Running.
• Possession Receiver (Receiver is more likely to keep possession of the football, even when tackled. Big Hitters are a tad more likely to force a drop on these receivers.): 90+ Catch In Traffic
• Spectacular Catch Receiver (Receiver is more likely to pull off a spectacular catch, like One handed catches, diving catches and tip toe catches on the sideline. However, these catches leave them open to Big Hitter that can jar the ball out of their hands.): 90+ Spectacular Catch.
• Hands (Receiver has very reliable hands. But they need to get open to be able to make the catch. Note that a combination of this role and the Quick Receiver role, at least assuming you believe my theory that in old Maddens Awareness is the Route Running stat for WR, are Gen6's Possession Receiver.): 90+ Catching.
  
• Shutdown Corner (The corner sticks to his man even during cuts more effectively. Only Quick Receivers have a chance to beat this corner. This is actually Containment Corner in Gen6): 92+ Man Coverage.
• Smart Corner (Allows the corner to bring up the Offensive Play Cam, but only for WR routes.): 90+ Play Recognition.
• Press Coverage Corner (Press Coverage prevents receivers from leaving the line of scrimmage and getting on their routes. Quick Receivers can release from the press far faster than most receivers. Press Coverage doesn't work in Madden 08. At least, that's what I've found.): 92+ Press
  
• Smart Safety (Allows the safety to bring up the Offensive Play Cam, and it shows all of the offense's plays. This only can happen if the offense keeps calling the same play repeatedly.): 90+ Play Recognition.
• Smart Linebacker (Allows the linebacker to bring up the Offensive Play Cam, but only for HB plays. This only can happen if the offense keeps calling the same play repeatedly.): 90+ Play Recognition.
• Big Hitter (Hit Stick tackles are more likely to cause fumbles, is capable of tiring players and to cause injuries. Covering the ball means less fumbles however.): 88+ Hit Power.
• Brick Wall Defender (Their tackles are nearly impossible to escape from. Only Power and Elusive Backs have a chance to escape the tackle. A combination of this and Big Hitter makes up the Heavy Hitter Linebacker weapon and the Big Hitter Safety weapon): 91+ Tackling.
  
• Finesse Move D-Lineman (Pass Rusher in Gen6. Spin and Rip moves are more effective. This effectiveness is reduced against Pass Blockers. Despite the name, some Linebackers could get this weapon as well.): 92+ Finesse Moves.
• Power Move D-Lineman (Run Stopper in Gen6. Bull rushes are more effective. The effectiveness is lower against Crushing Run Blockers. Again, some Linebacker could get this weapon): 92+ Power Moves.
  
• Crushing Run Blocker (Run Blocker in Gen6. The blocker was more capable of pushing back whoever he was blocking. This weapon is nullified if he meets a Power Move D-Lineman.): 95+ Run Block Strength.
• Pass Blocker (The blocker was more capable of dealing with defenders when in pass protection. However, given time, Finesse Move D-Linemen can go through these blockers.): 94+ Pass Block Strength.
  
• Accurate Kicker (Sadly, Kickers and Punters got the middle finger in Gen6.): 92+ Kick Accuracy
• Big Foot Kicker: 92+ Kick Power
  
• Speed (Lots of roles in Gen6: Speed Back for RBs, Deep Threat for WRs, Playmaker for LBs, Quick Corner for CBs and Coverage Safety for FSs and SSs): 96+ Speed.

[Eros]

Good stuff. Now I dont have to simulate just to let the AI assign the roles. I can make an excel template to validate all players if they qualify/lose a particular role. I actually update the attribute ratings often during the season everytime EA release their ratings update.

Thanks. Well im glad that you are interested in this small project Roger. The purpose of this project is to be implemented in your franchises and rosters so anyone who wants can play it.

Could we finalize this?

I would like to make some small changes that jose21crisis suggested and add some other weapons that i haven't yet found a definition, like project player role, then i will make a new release so you can implemented as soon as possible in you next release.

If I may add, we can also make use of attributes non-existent in Madden08 (Catch in Traffic, Press etc) so they can be of use to power up the roles for Elder Madden.

If i may ask how can non-existent in Madden08 attributes be translated in Madden 08 to power up the existing roles?

[Col. Trautman]

I for one would like to see the Smart QB role in the pc version, seeing the defense playart could be cool

[rogerjinx]

If I may add, we can also make use of attributes non-existent in Madden08 (Catch in Traffic, Press etc) so they can be of use to power up the roles for Elder Madden.

If i may ask how can non-existent in Madden08 attributes be translated in Madden 08 to power up the existing roles?

Some of these attributes are Ball Carrier Vision, Stiff Arm, Spin Move, Juke Move etc. Since many of these are not used when I integrate Ea ratings to Madden 08, we may use them as qualifiers for player weapon/roles.

For example, the Power Back weapon pre-requisites are:
a) 80+ Strength
b) 82+ Break Tackle
c) 80+ Stiff Arm
d) This weapon will be removed if any of the above ratings are not met at any given point during the season.

Since EA does the ratings update weekly and I do it every four weeks, I can assess on each of my roster updates which player gain/maintain/lose weapon roles
You only need to set the pre-requisites for each weapon/role and I will handle the assignment/removal on each player on each update so we dont need to wait for the off-season to see if they will maintain/lose their weapon/role.

I have already made a template but only with the pre-requisites you made. There are some missing roles like Player Distraction, Clutch Kicker, Injury Prone, Project Player & etc. so I wish you can include those in your next update.

On the existing roster update I have, Carson Wentz & Big Ben are both qualified on 5 weapon/roles (see screenshot below) but we only need to choose 2 for them.

Madden Role Editor.png (145.57 KiB) Viewed 2884 times

[jose21crisis]

On the existing roster update I have, Carson Wentz & Big Ben are both qualified on 5 weapon/roles (see screenshot below) but we only need to choose 2 for them.

Both Ben and Carson would be qualified for 3 Weapons and 2 Roles. The Weapons are the ones you can see during gameplay, like Franchise QB, Feature Back, Power Back, Heavy Hitter and so on. The Roles are only shown on the Roster Management screen, but have effects over the player and his team. Roles like 1st Round Pick, Underachiever, NFL Icon, Clutch Kicker and so on.

In the image you show, both Big Ben and Carson Wentz are qualified for 3 weapons (Cannon Arm QB, Precision Passer and Franchise QB) as well as 2 Roles (Team Leader and Team Mentor). Some weapons should take priority over others. namely the star Weapons should take priority over the others. For example, if a HB has the requirements for Power Back, Speed Back, Elusive Back and Feature Back, he instantly becomes a Feature Back, because Feature Back is the star role for HBs, and as such takes higher priority. In the case of Big Ben and Carson Wentz, since they qualify for Cannon Arm QB, Precision Passer and Franchise QB, they instantly gain Franchise QB since that role is the star role for QBs, and as such has the highest priority.

Now, Carson Wentz is qualified for 2 Roles, which are 1st Round Pick and QB of the Future. The requirements for the 1st Round Pick role are simply get selected in the 1st round. And the role is lost after the player has 5 years in the league, at which point it is replaced by Underachiever if the player's overall is too low, or by another role if the player qualifies for another role. The requirements for QB of the Future are:

• a) This role is applied to QB that is Drafted in the 1st or 2nd Round.
• This role is lost if the QB is a starter for more than a year. (16+ games after the Offseason)
• This QB will lose his role if another QB is drafted in the 1st or 2nd round while he is on the roster or if he fails to meet expectations by his 4th year in the league.
• This player expects to be starting by his 3rd year in the league

Since Carson has played more than 16 games, he doesn't qualify for the QB of the Future role, and as such is a 1st Round Pick.

As for Big Ben, he qualifies for Team Leader and Team Mentor. The Team Leader's requirements are:

• 3+ Productive years in the league (1+ Pro Bowl selection)
• 82+ Overall
• 75+ Morale

And the requirements for Team Mentor are:

• 6+ Years in the league
• 80+ Overall
• 80+ Awareness

He qualifies for both. My recommendation for this would be to make the Team Mentor role a higher priority over Team Leader. With that in mind, Big Ben would be a Team Mentor.

So all in all, Carson Wentz would be a Franchise QB and a 1st Round Pick. Big Ben would be a Franchise QB and a Team Mentor.

I would like to make some small changes that jose21crisis suggested and add some other weapons that i haven't yet found a definition, like project player role, then i will make a new release so you can implemented as soon as possible in you next release.

Mind if I make a list based on yours with the remaining roles, as well as some Weapon and Role priorities (Shutdown Corner has higher priority than Quick Corner, for example) using the M08's own standards (The descriptions it uses for the SuperStar mode, which are based on the player ratings)?
Actually, never mind on this one.